Discussing Kalel-Gate with LayVegan, Critical Thought & BernieBro
Analysing the fall out, other vegans reaction to another ex-vegan.
Lay Vegan: I thought this would be a great opportunity to talk about the coherency of labels, the definition of veganism, why incidents like this seem to divide us and you know what’s behind this dichotomy just in like the responses that her video has garnered as these inevitably do with with ex-vegans.
The uneasy à-bas-le-ciel + Unnatural Vegan collaboration
It was a thing once upon a time. Although UV holds the position of not mentioning smaller channels on youtube that they don’t recommend for concern of popularizing their channel, Eisel mentions her ever so often and sends a tweet their way.
They fought the good fight against diet pseudoscience, but it wasn’t to last. They still cover much of the same topics, even covering the same response videos to the same people.
I intended to make a series on their disagreements so as to hilight the different factions of the movement they represent, but after the first video it just became too much of a mammoth task to try and distill down so many videos. I may pick it up again one day:
- Unnatural Vegan vs à-bas-le-ciel: on making the personal/private – public
- On critique
- On living with domesticated animals
- On consequentialism (effective altruism vs. historical nihilism)
- On community
All started off with this video recording of AY fans sabotaging another vegan project at his encouragement. In the description I wrote an open letter to Isaac and summary of the conflict with the Philosophical Vegan forum to counter his BS framing:
So public invite to your discord, I feel I might as well tell you I re-joined soon as you booted me, I’m really happy to come back under my real name if you’d prefer so you’d see when I was online, can answer questions and be the resident philo/commie punch bag, I just am going to be keeping tabs because you’re spreading racism at the same time as veganism and mixing the two. And it’s not like you aren’t encouraging your fans to troll the wiki and they aren’t vociferously combing the forum for screencaps.
Hope the share links for the Piers Morgan video are helpful, all the best, Theo.
— History of conflict with the philosophical vegan platform —
• AY dismisses FriendEd with poor use of NTT, Brim leaves comments highlighting the contradictions so could address the root implications of FriendEd’s philosophy with him. FriendEd invites Brim on his channel to debate.
• AY takes huge personal insult, starts making attack videos on the forum, portraying us as pushing absurdly complicated advocacy, when we’re simply critiquing his arguments and philosophy.
• At the same time as we’re simply discussing the arguments among a small group on the forum, I’m sharing wiki articles about vegan lifestyle to places like reddit, encouraging others to sign up and make edits themselves.
• AY pins a comment to his latest attack video encouraging people to troll the wiki, forcing us to lock the space up.
• AY opens up his discord with regular public links, so I release a video recording of them trolling the wiki.
• AY continues making attack videos, encouraging fans to crawl through the forum for information and make memes straw-manning the platform.
• Still being in the discord through public links, I’m able to make short jokesy videos and long recordings of content that interests me (NTT, racism, ethics, not personal gossip).
Racism in Veganism – 2018 Year in Review
- Isaac defending Cory and Tara McCarthy on race IQ
- Isaac stating his belief that having mixed race children will likely be lower IQ
- His promotion of Jack Green while he knew his nazi beliefs.
- Jack’s full outing himself as classical nazi.
- Trying to cover his tracks without public retraction and denounciation.
- AskYourself’s Discord – Vegan FBI cover blown!
- Isaac Scarface
- Keyboard Warrior vs. The Animal Holocaust [Mirror]
- E01: Ask Yourself vs. Unethical Vegan (Longer Version) | Ask Yourself Pirate Radio
- E02: On Philosophy & Neuroscience | Ask Yourself Pirate RadioThe Worst Case for White Nationalism | Ask Yourself Pirate Radio #3
- Wildlife Management Paradigm vs. NameTheTrait | Ask Yourself Pirate Radio #4
- Right Wing Vegans in 2018 | Ask Yourself Pirate Radio #5
- Playing Conspiracy Theories Off Against Each Other | Ask Yourself Pirate Radio #6
- JackGreen on White Nationalism and Mein Kampf
- A Safe Space For Neo-Nazis | The JF Gariépy Fan Club #1
- Charles Marlowe On The (((Globalist))) Cabal #1
- Where Are The Skype Logs Charles?? #2
- Charles Marlowe On The (((Globalist))) Cabal #3
- Charles Marlowe is Anti Women’s Right To Work and Vote #4
Disilusionment in his idol:
- Sam Harris’s Latest Backtracking on Veganism
- Ask Yourself fails to challenge Sam Harris with anything new on veganism | Sept 5th 2018
- Storybook in caption form of prodding the hornets nest that is Ask Yourself and his fanboys.
- Ask Yourself’s deleted videos
- Ask Yourself’s bullshit wishful thinking